5k Apocalypse

I am getting my 5k apocalypse list together and I want to see what you guys think.
Unfortunately, I do not own any Imperial Armor stuff but here is where I am so far.



Aspect Assault Wave

Autarch (Mandiblaster; Warp Jump Generators; Scorpion Chainsword; Fusion Gun) //Fire Dragons//

Dire Avengers (Bladestorm ; Defend ; Power Weapon; Shimmershield)
Wave Serpent(Star Engines; Shuriken Cannon; TL Bright Lances)

Fire Dragons (Crack Shot ; Dragon's Breath Flamer)
Wave Serpent (Star Engines; Shuriken Cannon; TL Bright Lances)

Howling Banshees (Acrobatic; Executioner)
Wave Serpent (Star Engines; Shuriken Cannon; TL Bright Lances)


Spirit Host

Warlock (Destructor; Spiritseer Upgrade; Witchblade)
Warlock (Destructor; Spiritseer Upgrade; Witchblade)
Warlock (Enhance; Spiritseer Upgrade; Witchblade)

10 Wraithguard
Warlock (Enhance ; Spiritseer Upgrade; Witchblade)

Wraithlord (Flamer x2; Bright Lance; Missile Launcher)
Wraithlord (Flamer x2; Bright Lance; Missile Launcher)
Wraithlord (Flamer x2; Bright Lance; Missile Launcher)


The Phoenix Court of Khaine

Avatar
Asurmen
Baharroth
Fuegan
Jain Zar
Karandras
Maugan Ra


Other

Falcon (Holo-Field; Spirit Stones; Star Engines; Vectored Engines; Scatter Laser; Shuriken Cannon)
5 Dire Avengers (basic)

Fire Prism (Holo-Field; Spirit Stones; Star Engines; Vectored Engines; Shuriken Cannon)

Eldrad Ulthran //with Banshees//




The debate

Now, for my last 500 or so points I am trying to decide what would be more beneficial


1. I could beef up the Assault Wave with Scorpions

Striking Scorpions (Stalker; Scorpion Chainsword; Scorpion Claw)
Wave Serpent (Star Engines; Shuriken Cannon; TL Bright Lances)


2. I could add another formation, but I only own 3 War Walkers so 1 in each squad
The Cloak of Shadow and Web of Twilight formation rules makes this a tempting option

Shadow Walker War Walker Host
War Walker (Spirit Stones; Scatter Laser; Scatter Laser)
War Walker (Spirit Stones; Scatter Laser; Scatter Laser)
War Walker (Spirit Stones; Scatter Laser; Scatter Laser)


3. I could add more Farseers


4. I could add a beefy Harlequin Troupe to run with the Phoenix Court

Wave Serpent: Cannon vs Catapult

I hear this conversation all the time, and my true motive for posting this here is only to bring another idea/use for the Shuriken Cannon out. I bring it to every game and pop pesky vehicles/dreads in the side/rear constantly.


Theory
The Eldar Wave Serpent is our transport/tank hybrid vehicle and personally, I think it is by far the best vehicle in the game. It is my opinion that it should maximize both roles to be completely effective. I understand Eldar players may often want to move more than 6” in a turn thus voiding the Shuriken Cannon’s effectiveness for the majority of the game. The difference here is the potentiality now exists where you CAN shoot at vehicles and blow them up on the few turns you NEED to, instead of always shooting your two garbage shots that NEVER do anything worthwhile. Also when/if your main weapon is destroyed, you are STILL a threat.

Turn 1 – 3 Wave Serpent is a transport vehicle
Turn 3 – 6 Wave Serpent is a tank


Shuriken Catapult – 12” Range, S4, AP5, Assault 2, Twin-Linked
These will always hit with the TL, but will only wound 50% of the time against MEQ who will get a 3+ armor save anyway. If you fire this gun every turn (which you wont due to 12" range), you may realistically kill 2-5 troops in an entire game. They need 6’s to glance AV10 vehicles and are honestly not a threat to anyone.


Shuriken Cannon – 24” Range, S6, AP5, Assault 3 +10 points
With the BS: 3 you will only hit 1 – 2 shots each turn but your target completely changes. AV10/11 Vehicles become juicy possibilities, especially later in the game. If you fire this gun 3 times in a game, you may realistically penetrate 1 – 3 vehicles in a game, combine this with a Bright Lance and your target priority becomes much stronger.


Paired with Bright Lances
If you decide to shoot at a vehicle with a single Bright Lance, you have one shot to make it happen. If you hit, and you penetrate, and they do not have a cover save, and you actually roll on the chart they still have a 1-6 shot of nothing really happening. If you can combine this with 3 more shots at the same vehicle that you are already shooting at anyway, you have 1-3 more rolls to make that puppy blow up.


Eat Vehicles
I want to show you some of the vehicles you can pwn with Shuriken Cannon’s that you can’t touch with Shuriken Catapults. And you know just as well as I do how awesome Serpents are at moving into position when you need them to.

S6 vs AV10 = 4+ to Glance, vs AV11 = 5+ to Glance


AV 10 All around
Vypers
Land Speeder (These taste the best)
Raiders
Trukk

Side 10, Rear 10
Chimera

Front 11, Side 11, Rear 10
Looted Wagon
Whirlwind
Razorback
Rhino
Piranha Light Skimmer
Immolator
Penitent Engine

Side 11, Rear 10
Predator
Vindicator
Ravagers
Rhino
Killer Kans
Devilfish
Excorcist

Rear AV10
Dreadnought (These taste pretty good too)
Defiler
Hellhound
Lehman Russ Battle Tank
Battlewagon
Hammerhead Gunships
Sky Ray Missile Defence Gunships
Deff Dread

Rear AV11
Soul Grinders
Lehman Russ Demolisher

Eldar: Local Tourney List

2k point Local Tourney List

this is what my evolved list has become, separated by units


Passing Team

Elite: Howling Banshees/Eldrad
HQ:Eldrad Ulthran
9 Howling Banshees
Howling Banshee Exarch (Executioner)
Wave Serpent (Shuriken Cannon; Bright Lance)

Troops: Dire Avengers
9 Dire Avengers
Dire Avenger Exarch (Bladestorm; Defend; Power Weapon; Shimmershield)
Wave Serpent (Shuriken Cannon; Bright Lances)

Troops: Dire Avengers
5 Dire Avengers
Falcon (Holo-Field; Shuriken Cannon; Scatter Laster)



Running Team

HQ: Avatar (Eater of Worlds)

Heavy Support: Wraithlord
(Flamer x2; Bright Lance; Missile Launcher)

Troops: Wraithguard
10 Wraithguard
Warlock (Enhance; Spiritseer; Witchblade)

Heavy Support: Dark Reapers
4 Dark Reapers
1 Dark Reaper Exarch (Crack Shot ; Reaper Launcher)

Total Roster Cost: 1997

3,500 Point Eldar vs Dark Angels on Sunday

VS
We are going to take the first 6 missions from the Ard Boyz and D6 it.

The Force Organization chart is a little difficult to deal with but we did not want to bump up into an actual full fledge appocolypse game. I wanted to use some of the units that I typically leave in the foam but after agonizing over my list all week I still cannot find space for Shining Spears, Warp Spiders, Swooping Hawks, Vypers, War Walkers, etc, etc, etc. I never use any of the Eldar Fast attack options (save a Vyper squad on occasion) and it didn’t really hit me until now that aside from Vypers in a Saim Hann list, Eldar fast attack units are garbage. I could honestly never see a situation where I would be happy that my Warp Spiders or even Swooping Hawks came in on a Deep Strike. I love Scourges in Dark Eldar but the Lasblaster is no Splinter Cannon and the Exarch upgrades seem fun but not actually useful enough to replace anything I already use. If the Warp Spiders had an actual AP value I could see them dominating all over the board but taking close range pop shots are noth worth the mathmatical potentiality of “if you make them take enough saving throws they will fail some of them” Logic.

So, I typically favor Scorpions over Harlequins and Dark Lances over Fire Dragons but they made the list this time around and I will see how that goes. My biggest problem with Harlequins is that the unit does too much and I often find myself underutilizing their potential. I see a lot of horde armies and honestly, what would you rather throw at a mob of boys a full comand of Scorpions or a full comand of Harlequins? I was extremely temped to take two full commands of Wraithguards and Banshees but I think my list is solid enough without the slow pace of even more foot sloggers and a second group of girls might be unnecessary even if I will be up against a Death Wing full of Terminators.

My list is looking like

Farseers, Warlocks
Banshees, Harlequins, Fire Dragons
Dire Avengers, Wraithguards, Pathfinders
Wraithlords, Falcon

I will post my full list after the game with a report on how things went, wish me luck!

Lately

My game club meets every Sunday and I have played quite a few more games since the last bunch of posts but I tend to work on many units without finishing anything and I hate taking pictures of my 25% - 75% painted models. I figure I am well past due for an update so here are some of my newer projects in process.

2.5k Ard Boyz List

2500 Pts - Altansar Eldar Roster - Ard Boys

HQ: Avatar

HQ: Eldrad Ulthran

Troops: Dire Avengers
10 Dire Avengers
Exarch(Bladestorm; Defend; Power Weapon; Shimmershield)

Wave Serpent
Spirit Stone; Vectored Engines;
Shuriken Cannon; TL Scatter Laser

Troops: Pathfinders (Rangers)
8 Pathfinders (Rangers)

Troops: Wraithguard
10 Wraithguard
Spiritseer (Destructor; Witchblade)

Troops: Guardian Squad
10 G Defender Squad (Shuriken Cannon)
Spiritseer (Destructor; Singing Spear)

Elite: Howling Banshees
10 Howling Banshees
Exarch(War Shout; Acrobatic; Executioner)

Wave Serpent
Spirit Stone; Star Engines; Vectored Engines;
Shuriken Cannon; TL Bright Lances

Elite: Striking Scorpions
10 Striking Scorpions
Exarch(Shadowstrike; Stalker; Biting Blade)

Heavy Support: Dark Reapers
5 Dark Reapers
Exarch(Crack Shot; Reaper Launcher)

Heavy Support: Wraithlord
Flamer (x2); Bright Lance; Missile Launcher

Heavy Support: Wraithlord
Flamer (x2); Bright Lance; Missile Launcher

Total Roster Cost: 2500

Ard Boyz

After looking through the missions for Ard Boyz, specifically the bonus point sections are you guys changing your lists up?

I hesitated taking the Avatar, or at least running him as I normally do because of the HQ point dish out in mission 2. I am only running with 26 KP (10kp from 2 HQ's), but he seems like an easy +5 bonus points and I know I would target him if going against Eldar. Being a distraction unit is kind of the point of the Avatar so it might work even better than normal, but giving extra tourney points can be the kiss of death and I could switch him out for something more survivable.

I beefed up my core units for the same reason, anyone else switching it up to accommodate the scenarios?